OFF английский через skype

[azu]

Один мой знакомый хочет практиковаться в английском с носителями языка (платно). У нас в городе найти таковых нелегко. Подскажите, пожалуйста, какие-нибудь проверенные ресурсы на этот счет.

Спасибо!

[frau_anna]

Если речь идет о skype (как указано в теме поста), пусть Ваш знакомый добавит себе в контакты сколько угодно англоязычных товарищей и общается с ними ))) А относительно **Подскажите, пожалуйста, какие-нибудь проверенные ресурсы на этот счет** (если абстрагироваться от темы skype), то сложно сказать )))

[Val61]

Посоветуйте ему записывать на магнитофон новости Би-Би-Си и заучивать с пленки (диска) наизусть. Это на нек. время займет вашего знакомого, а там, глядишь, и рассосется. В похожей ситуации Пушкин советовал своему приятелю Чаадаеву: "Мой друг, ты ...этта... Души прекрасные порывы".

[Nina79]

I have a friend who teaches over Skype from the States if you are interested. (Est podruga, kotoraya prepodaet cherez Skype s Shtatov, esli Vam takoi interesno.)

[Supa Traslata]

>>пусть Ваш знакомый добавит себе в контакты сколько угодно англоязычных товарищей и общается с ними >>
Вот-вот. Это бесплатно.

[Nina79]

Supa and Frau

Unfortunately, by just talking to natives you won't really LEARN English. It's a good way to refine skills or to activate your vocabulary, but as a way to learn, not so great. Learning requires instruction. Any ol' Jo on Skype is not going to explain to you the finer points of grammar or the nuances of a word or context or why with an article a sentence means one thing and without something else entirely. One, he probably doesn't know the real answer and two, he probably doesn't want to tell you because that's boring and he is there to chat and have fun.

[Supa Traslata]

Nina79,
>>to chat and have fun>>
ясный пень.

[Nina79]

Supa

Right, so how do you think this guy/girl is going to teach you English? The idea that a person can "pick a language up" is a fallacy. You either need instruction or you need to be the kind of person who is going to give yourself mini lessons everytime you come across something you dont know or which gives you difficulty. I mean come on, how many Russians can I count which have told me that they lived in the US or England for X amount of years and they think their English is really good so they have decided to work as translators/editors/teachers? - I already can't count these fools on my 20 fingers and toes. Their English is at best, intermediate in most cases because they were not learning, but surviving. And the language you "pick up" from everyday conversation is normally no better than they half-literate language most native speakers use every day. The same goes for expats living here in Russia. We don't learn Russian by talking to the average folks on the street. That way we learn the mistakes and the illiterate constructions of the average Russian (and negrammotnost is rampant in Russia). Those of us who know know Russian have learned it by receiving instruction and by researching the meaning of words and the correctness of constructions we have heard from the average bloke.
Akh, I have gone off on a rant. But you get my point. Just opening up a Skype account and chatting with people is not going to help this person LEARN English.

[wolfik]

Supa, что то вы чересчур тут выпендриваетесь со своим английским.

[Nina79]

wolfik,

Supa hasn't said anything in English on this 'vetka'.

[black_velvet]

Learning requires instruction. Any ol' Jo on Skype is not going to explain to you the finer points of grammar

I think that those 'Skype learners' don’t want any explanations. If they really did they would have long since found them. The sources are many. The reasoning behind learning English through Skype goes as follows – now I will be able to talk talk TALK and blast those boring grammarians. Because most people are lazy and they want learning to speak to be as effortless as it was in their childhood when moms, dads, grannies were running around them cooing, giving them toys, endlessly repeating the names for different things and asking “Oh, look, what do we have here?”. And then they would gradually pick it all up and put it together.
But Scype won’t put them back in those blissful days. And they will find out that they are back to the square one – the only difference being the location of the teacher.

[Nina79]

black_velvet

Actually, some Skype learners have no choice. For some languages, you really do need to go the way of Skype. Beyond that, some of them are very serious - with text books and audio and video chat. And they actually do pay for their lessons (PayPal) - that's the amazing part.

People who are not going to bother making the call and are going to just type as if they were on ICQ are a different story - they will find that they will get nowhere.

[black_velvet]

some of them are very serious - with text books and audio and video chat.
Some learners are very serious, Skype or no Skype. ;)

[Nina79]

black_velvet

Well of course.
All I meant was that some Skype learners are more serious than a lot of people think. And for that matter, the teachers are more serious than most people think.

[Shumov]

Am I the only one who cannot see the word 'learn' in Asker's question?.. Isn't chatting with native speakers what we call 'practising'?

[Shumov]

practicing that is

[Nina79]

Shumov,

That's what I am talking about. That is why I told Supa that you can't just suggest that they open up a Skype account and add a bunch of native speakers. They need to find a real teacher (on Skype or off) who can TEACH them.

[Serge1985]

Shumov
+1
The asker put it forward that "his acquaintance wants to have a bit of speech practice". Thus, Skype is all right, imho )))

Susan, hi ))

[Serge1985]

Nina79
and if he/she just wants to reactivate his/her passive vocabulary?

[Nina79]

Right but the asker also said "platno" which implies that the guy actually wants to learn and not practise. At this point, who the hell knows what he actually wants.

Sergei, HI!

[Shumov]

Nina79, why do you insist on TEACHING them?... They want to практиковаться в английском с носителями языка.... Who says anything about teaching or LEARNING???.... They want to practice their [existing] skills, which for all we know are greater than yours or indeed mine...

[black_velvet]

Shumov, and why do they need that 'bit of speech practice' - how do you think?

[Nina79]

Shumov,
1. I doubt they are better than mine.
2. I assume that someone who is willing to pay is not just looking to repeat the same stuff he/she already knows, but is looking to add something to it, which implies being taught if you are going to pay the person you are talking to.

[naturalblue]

Господа спорящие, кто-нибудь из вас преподаватель английского? С соответствующим образованием - т.е. педагогическим?

[Serge1985]

Nina79
imho, it isn't worth "going off on a rant", but ask the topic starter to specify what he/she wants as a matter of fact))

[Shumov]

black_velvet
I have no idea why. Nor am I interested in finding out.

Nina79, if I wish to practice sex with someone and are willing to pay for it, it doesn't imply I need (or want) to be taught.
___________________
Is there any point in this conversation?

[Nina79]

naturalblue
You're looking at one right here.

Serge
My rant was accidental. I must be having a slow day at work today. :)

Shumov
Touche!
But I discerened this more from the context around things. But still, touche! The birdie to you!

[Serge1985]

naturalblue
according to the Diploma I'm a qualified secondary school teacher of foreign languages. why?

[Serge1985]

Shumov
lol )))

[naturalblue]

Ладно, ждать ответа не буду. Если кто учился на препода, то он знает, что есть активный и пассивный словарный запас.
Выражение "repeat the same stuff he/she already knows" относится к активному.
Но есть и пассивный - то, что мы теоретически знаем, но сомневаемся, не знаем как употреблять, и просто регулярно забываем.
Вот для этого и нужно общаться.
Что за непонятное упорство, Нина? Зачем вообще нужен язык человеку? Общаться с учителями? Всю жизнь?

[Serge1985]

then just look closer at the post:

"Serge1985 7.08.2009 17:02 link
Nina79
and if he/she just wants to reactivate his/her passive vocabulary?"

that's the idea I pointed to as I have the same reason to use Skype speech practicing.

[black_velvet]

I have no idea why. Nor am I interested in finding out.

Because before offering advice on how to ‘practice language skills’ it’s a good idea to have at least some understanding of the goals.

[naturalblue]

Звиняйте, Серж. Подслеповата стала. Собственно, мой довод нацелен на Нину.

[Nina79]

naturalblue

The asker said the person is willing to pay - i take this to mean that they are looking for a teacher. How my discussing why I think what I think is 'uporstvo' I'm not really sure. Am I supposed to just say "Oh, yeah, oh, sorry, yes master" because someone else interpreted something another way? I don't think so, love.

As for the active/passive vocabulary - yes, you know the theory, but do you know how most things work in reality?

[naturalblue]

Not according to the theory you mean? )) Don't start generalizing, лапочка )))

[nephew]

гоголеск, а сколько лет вы уже живете в России?

[Shumov]

black_velvet,
Please remind me, where did I offer "advice on how to practice language skills"? Ta in advance.))

[Serge1985]

naturalblue
все в порядке ))

[Shumov]

сейчас кое-кого назовут "кисулей" и понесется!...

[naturalblue]

Shumov
Лишь бы не pussy ))) А так стерпеть можно. Хотя иногда даже pussy воспринимается лучше чем love.

[Serge1985]

Shumov
ничего страшного, я сбегаю за попкорном. Вам захватить? ))))

PS
Рад Вас приветствовать

PPS
Коллеги, какой смысл спорить, если аскер не появляется и не уточняет детали?

[black_velvet]

Please remind me, where did I offer "advice on how to practice language skills"? Ta in advance.))

Isn't that what this thread is all about - 'practicing language skills' ? ?
Or whatever people mean by that.

[nephew]

а гоголеск куда пропала? работать пошла? as translator/editor/teacher?

[Shumov]

black_velvet

You asking me? If so, than no, this thread is not about that. Try and guess waht it is really about though...

nephew,
и как назло (и как всегда) на самом интересном месте!

[Nina79]

naturalblue
Who's generalizing? I asked you a simple question.

Nephew
7 years
And yes, I was working. Is that a crime? :)

[naturalblue]

Наш с Вами диалог закончился на love

[Nina79]

HAHAH! that's hysterical, especially because I meant nothing bad by it. "love" is nothing bad.

[naturalblue]

Ну тогда ладно - возобновляю, но уже в последний раз, а то самой стыдно. Я просто не хочу мериться ...эээ. Ну тем, чего у нас с вами, судя по всему все равно нет. Вот. Прошу прощения у всех за "понесло"

[Maksym Kozub]

Nina79:
The asker said the person is willing to pay - i take this to mean that they are looking for a teacher. How my discussing why I think what I think is 'uporstvo' I'm not really sure. Am I supposed to just say "Oh, yeah, oh, sorry, yes master" because someone else interpreted something another way?

No, you are not supposed to.say that. I must add, however, that "somebody" did not _interpret_ anything in _any_ way, until _you_ started interpreting something in some way :). You did it by making conclusions about "the guy actually wants to learn and not practise", "they are looking for a teacher" etc.

I do not mean that your interpretation is necessarily wrong. I always prefer, however, to start with the most durect meaning of the request. In this case, that direct meaning was just "The person wants to practice". As far as his willingness to pay is concerned... I sometimes start thinking I will probably pay membersip fees and join some club attended by, say, bank lawyers, or information security peofessionals, simply because I want to refresh my knowledge in the respective areas, to listen to some interesting real-life examples for analysis, etc..I do not need a banking law teacher though.

To make it short, I am with Shumov on this one.

[black_velvet]

black_velvet
You asking me?

Actually, I wasn't asking you. I knew the answer before you entered this thread.
I’ve heard and seen enough of this ‘drive to practice’ in my life to be able to draw my own conclusions.

[Shumov]

I see.

[black_velvet]

Very well!

[azu]

Всем спасибо за ответы, к сожалению, не смогла принять участие в обсуждении, т.к. рабочий день закончился.
У г-на в вопросе ОГРОМНЫЙ словарный запас, все понимает, но разговаривать не может. Это крупный менеджер, поэтому ему нужно, чтобы вторая сторона несла обязательства быть на связи в нужное ему время, вариант знакомства и чата ему не подходит.